Friday, 28 September 2012
  0 Replies
  53 Visits
0
Votes
Undo
  Subscribe
Dear Sheldon, Dear All Forum Users: many of us played different basses. Than: there is a moment wherein the Bassplayer settles with Primas (if incredibly rich), or poormen's Z with no top (if low-budjeted like me). What about cables? As far as I have understood, EVIDENCE AUDIO LYRIC HG is top rated. But: I discovered ANALYSIS-PLUS OVAL PRO STUDIO and ANALYSIS-PLUS YELLOW OVAL. Bottom line: is it woth it? Is there a REAL difference between 20 diollars cables and fetish-oriented ones? OK: we all are, a little bit fetish about our instrumnets... Thanks 4 Ur thoughts!!!
9 years ago
·
#24722
0
Votes
Undo
I have some Analysis Plus Black Oval Instrument Cables and there is a difference. I would say there is more output and better bass response. In a live setting band mix, I do not know that you would be able to tell a difference, but soloed, you can tell. There is also a noticeable higher quality to the cable. Is it worth the extra money? I guess that depends on your budget!
9 years ago
·
#24741
0
Votes
Undo
Basically if you're using active pickups there's absolutely no need for extra posh cables. Just buy anything that will hold out physically and easy to stock and travel. I don't like SOME Evidence cables due to that you have to roll them and takes up as much space as a drum cymbal in its bag. George L I loathe. I think it's an even wash. Up above a certain price, it's no different. I've used completely sealed cables, on is from the end of the 70s, still running and I have toured, and packed it inside several gig bags. It's a whirlwind. Just check, if it's not microphonic, and makes noise when you move it, or pickup up RF, then you're all set. Evidence, Lava, Analysis I think it's for high end studios only. There you can hear difference in super isolated studios and listening rooms with equally as posh monitors. But hey, it's bass we play, how much sizzling top end do you need? Really ? Live, no one will hear it anyway. Stay off the solderless cables though. Use soldered ones. Read the following links very thoroughly. http://www.audioholics.com/education/ca ... -snake-oil http://beta.musicradar.com/tuition/guit ... now-151562 http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/nov09/a ... cables.htm Contradictory in some ways, but it's only rocknroll. I have a resentment against all this audiophile HYPE in the electric bass and electric guitar cable industry. While we can detect how an acoustic instrument sounds in real life, without amplification, there's no proof or A/B test that can be done when comparing ANYTHING that is just electric. There's no cable that sounds better, they sound just different because there are no reference you can compare to when playing any electric bass or electric guitar. You must have any cable plugged in in order to hear it and compare it. They don't sound more "transparent" or "real" or more "High Fidelity" than any other because you really don't know how things sounds like acoustic, because they are not acoustic in any way. You can only compare it to what difference there is from the wire you used previously. At a stretch. My major gripe is Evidence Audios ads where they have David Gilmour as a flagship sponsor. Pink Floyd, the ultimate soundmaker band. He wows for them. I don't understand that. He's plus 60, he don't hear anything above 10 K anymore, and on top of this, everybody knows that he uses EMG pickups all of the time, which doesn't need any kind of "special" low impedance cables at all. He has enough to drive his cables long and through pedalboards without any loss anyway. Pretty futile if you'd ask me. But that's another topic... :)
9 years ago
·
#24742
0
Votes
Undo
I've read of some folks building buffer/ booster units that act as a clear, un-EQ'd signal boost, similar to having active circuitry on board. I personally don't see myself ever getting a really high end cable, especially since I'm not playing through super-high end amplification, and it'd be pretty disappointing to be on a gig with a subpar back line, plugging in your high end cable. I bet at a certain price point, it makes a difference over the cheap music-store cables I use now, but I'm sure there's also a point in high end cables, where no matter how much extra you're paying, it makes no difference.
9 years ago
·
#24743
0
Votes
Undo
I for one, have forgotten more cables at venues after playing gigs, than I have mislaid and forgotten picks (when playing guitar). I just don't want to leave posh cables behind, having forget to pack them in in any gig bag. I'd rather buy a couple of low-end or medium-end cables and have as a couple of spare ones. If a cable should break, or go bad when gigging, you have that spare with you, that you know works. Wonder if you can have a speare Analysis with you, if they ever crack up when playing live. No matter how sturdy they are. And of course, my gripe wouldn't be that huge if I'd forgotten a cheap cable behind. I'd go with the loss... if I forgot an Evidence or Analysis... I would get very pissed off, on that. On myself. And no, can't afford to buy a new one all of the time.
9 years ago
·
#24744
0
Votes
Undo
I can't say I hear a difference between a high end cable, and a cheap one. But why risk tone and reliability with a cheap one? My cables have more to do with function than sound. My two prefered brands are Monster and Planet Waves -- 15 foot max. Anything longer than 15' and you get too much attenuation, and more opportunity for EM interference. Both brands are "lifetime" guaranteed. And as mentioned in earlier posts, what you're using it for makes a huge difference. I wouldn't buy an Analysis or Evidence cable for gigging (because I will either forget it or it will grow legs). But I am DEFINITELY considering one (or two) for recording. Here's some food for thought. Apparently, the Line6 digital wireless can give you one heck of a clean signal. There's maybe 1 or 2 feet of cable between your instrument jack and your amp, with a digital signal in between. The Relay G50 is on my wishlist. [url:bstoipiz]http://line6.com/relay/[/url:bstoipiz] I have a cable question too. Has anyone compared the signal quality between the standard 12' Monster instrument cable, and their bass specialty cable? I can't hear a difference, but the Bass cable costs more. Andrew
9 years ago
·
#24745
0
Votes
Undo
[quote="AndrewK":1ic92klh]Here's some food for thought. Apparently, the Line6 digital wireless can give you one heck of a clean signal. There's maybe 1 or 2 feet of cable between your instrument jack and your amp, with a digital signal in between. The Relay G50 is on my wishlist. [url:1ic92klh]http://line6.com/relay/[/url:1ic92klh] Andrew[/quote:1ic92klh] I'd be curious whether these affect tone at all and whether passive or active make a difference on how well it handles it.
9 years ago
·
#24746
0
Votes
Undo
Also, I think this thread has been just about comparing the CHEAPEST cables with the MOST EXPENSIVE and High-End. [i:f0zshkjn]Just as that there are no alternatives but the cheapest and the most expensive, around! [/i:f0zshkjn] :roll: You have pretty much everything else in between, too. Maybe even most of them are in between these two extremes. "Mid-End" for a lack of better word. Whirlwind, Switchcraft, Planet Waves are all OK. Klotz, with Neutriks on. In studio, you can have resident high-end cables that will make difference. Perhaps. Very few people I know, (to tell the truth, not any) have stood a double blind test of different high-end cables with instruments and amps they are familiar with. But as with all other products. Those tiny 2-3 percent of "better sound" - or whatever - in a cable, will NOT end up just 2-3 percent increase in price. It will be 70-80 percent increase in price. At least. I've passed that phase in my life, thinking 2-3 percent of better sound, physical quality, are worth 80 percent in price increase. It's snake oil in this cable bussiness. The only thing that I buy when hearing all this mumbo jumbo - when electrical engineers are explaining it - is that the shorter cable, the better. And soldered. Period. The rest I think is pure snake oil. Braided things, skin-effect, direction sensitive, oxygen and halogen free bla bla brouhahaa and rolled on the thighs of a virgin during full moon. :? Give me a break will you. Because too few of us will ever hear this, or even waste time in empirical research to debunk or proving all these myths. Changing out your strings to new ones, will bring even better sound to your instrument than ANY cable out there. Go figure.
9 years ago
·
#24747
0
Votes
Undo
One of the links above sums all this cable thing up in one go, and I think it's one of the best ones around, to end all this discussion of which cables are the best: ----- Interestingly, the New Scientists recently commented on the [b:2xi6e900]London Heathrow Hi Fi Show[/b:2xi6e900], saying that among the cables selling for up to £30,000 for 6 metres, they found Quad demonstrating their latest speakers to great enthusiasm. The orange cable to the speakers looked oddly familiar. When asked about it, Tony Faulkner, the recording engineer demonstrating them (who'd used the speakers as monitors while recording Saint-Saen's complete works for piano & orchestra, Gramophone's Record of the Year), said of the cables: "[i:2xi6e900]Yes, they would look familiar if you have a garden. Before the show opened we went over the road to the DIY superstore and bought one of those £20 extension leads that Black & Decker sells for electric hedge-cutters. They are made from good, thick copper wire, look nice and sound good to me. The show's been running for three days and no one in the audience has noticed..." [/i:2xi6e900]- New Scientist Magazine TOUCHÉ! :shock:
9 years ago
·
#24748
0
Votes
Undo
[quote="Mats Eriksson":3hftfioh]"[i:3hftfioh]Yes, they would look familiar if you have a garden. Before the show opened we went over the road to the DIY superstore and bought one of those £20 extension leads that Black & Decker sells for electric hedge-cutters. They are made from good, thick copper wire, look nice and sound good to me. The show's been running for three days and no one in the audience has noticed..." [/i:3hftfioh]- New Scientist Magazine TOUCHÉ! :shock:[/quote:3hftfioh] Got to be power, because I've never seen a hedge trimmer with an audio cable in it, but still. Thats another one of those "you can spend your shirt" areas.
9 years ago
·
#24753
0
Votes
Undo
Well, it was pretty obvious wasn't it? That the cable used was a power cable from Black&Decker. What should it else be? And it was pursued by the company demo-ers as well, in a style of "Shhh... but don't tell anyone". I think brand names within the same price or even price range makes an even wash. Take any - say - 30-40 USD dollar cable (same length) from different manufacturers and compare. I highly doubt that you will hear any difference at all. On any instrument. I did a test between old Whirlwind, and those solderless George L of the same length. The only difference was that George L's cables was soldered onto the same plugs as Whirlwind. I even recorded it to test if there was anything to see in any graph or waveform. All things, RF pickup, microphonics, sturdiness, high-end treble, low end thump, signal loss was - not just about - but exactly the same.
9 years ago
·
#24759
0
Votes
Undo
Lots of opinions here, so I thought I'd throw in one or two more. From my perspective, unless money is a real problem, I see no reason to use cheap cables, since the higher probability of failure or going microphonic is something I won't tolerate. Similarly, for gigging applications, I would not use very expensive cables either, since wear and tear and possibility of damage (like when the cymbal stand falls on it, slicing it in half) make me want to leave any expensive cables home. Also, many of the super-expensive cables are rather thick and don't coil easily. I have a bunch of cables that were made for me using Canare GS6 cable and Neutrik plugs. They sound nice and the Canare cable comes in lots of nice colors. To my ears, different mid- and high-priced cables sound different to me. One of the worst sounding cables I tried was the Monster Bass 500 cable, which sounded like I had rolled off my passive tone control. On the other hand, the Monster Pro-link 1000 has the glassiest highs of all the cables that I have tried. My favorite sounding cable (of the ones that I have tried) is one made by George Allesandro, using cable from from Audioquest. Although I claim that mid-and high-priced cables do indeed sound different (even among themselves), I do admit that the marketing mumbo-jumbo on the box (time-aligned, optimized this or that, directionality, etc. ...) is total crap. For gigging, I use a Shure wireless on my main bass (a Dingwall, of course). It sounds OK for gigging, but in my basement music room with careful listening, it does sound inferior to any of the cables that I have. I would be surprised if a digital wireless would sound as good either, but have not tried one.
9 years ago
·
#24766
0
Votes
Undo
I say that if as fast as you drive anything active through any cable, any advantages or differences are lost. Completely. That's my experience throughout the years. I mean, LIVE, you're probably better off with mid-low priced. Mind you, I said there's a lot of difference between the cheapest of the cheapest, crap cables, and the high-end of the high-end. Wireless, to me, sounds exactly like someone has put some active pickups in my instrument. For some strange reason. A "limiting" or "compression" has occured, in some weird way. My mileage has varied. In studio, I think you're better off hearing any differences, but live I seriously doubt it. I do really have tried. And as you said. Live, these "monster" cables (not the brand) that knocks beer bottles over on the floor and can even weight so much that it actually changing presets on your pedalboard when they're undelbierately crossing a footswitch, can be more irritating and annoying than any sonic advantages.Little wonder people are using wireless! Evidence audio cables (some of them) can stand up like a real snake (animal) from a basket! They have solid cores. Not too sure about those really. For a resident installation where cables are not moving around, by all means, go ahead. I think the biggest mistake there ever was, was incorporating an unbalanced telejack on all electric instruments. An XLR type contact and balanced cable (like microphone or speaker cables) for all pickuped instruments would perform so much better in all areas, bucking all RF, noises, and carry a clear signal for miles on end. Especially when disconnecting the cable from the instrument, no huge crack would be heard through the speakers with risk of damaging the equipment. Today, they've bucked this with manufacturing "closing" switches or "earth kill" rings and "clutches" around the contacts, which always will fail eventually, too. Enough time given. -------------------------- I've even seen and experienced gearheads that used so much "high-end" and heavy-duty cables that it tripped their equipment over! Someone used thick and heavy high end cables to their 1,6 kg micro bass amp head. It was quite funny to see the amp head disappeared behind the speaker stack. Even if he put it back again on top, after a couple of minutes, it had SLID back to the rear edge of the cab just by the force from the cables tilting on it's rear edge! You could use the cables for bungy jumping if you'd like. It's scary when the cables are starting to weigh much more than any of the equipment it is connected to. Here we see ads about "1200 watts full power at just 1,6 kg!!" amps and then connect it with cables weighing 10 times more. Quite silly and laughable if you'd ask me. :)
9 years ago
·
#24769
0
Votes
Undo
[quote="Mats Eriksson":28sz17iw]Also, I think this thread has been just about comparing the CHEAPEST cables with the MOST EXPENSIVE and High-End. [i:28sz17iw]Just as that there are no alternatives but the cheapest and the most expensive, around! [/i:28sz17iw] :roll: You have pretty much everything else in between, too. Maybe even most of them are in between these two extremes. "Mid-End" for a lack of better word. Whirlwind, Switchcraft, Planet Waves are all OK. Klotz, with Neutriks on. In studio, you can have resident high-end cables that will make difference. Perhaps. Very few people I know, (to tell the truth, not any) have stood a double blind test of different high-end cables with instruments and amps they are familiar with. But as with all other products. Those tiny 2-3 percent of "better sound" - or whatever - in a cable, will NOT end up just 2-3 percent increase in price. It will be 70-80 percent increase in price. At least. I've passed that phase in my life, thinking 2-3 percent of better sound, physical quality, are worth 80 percent in price increase. It's snake oil in this cable bussiness. The only thing that I buy when hearing all this mumbo jumbo - when electrical engineers are explaining it - is that the shorter cable, the better. And soldered. Period. The rest I think is pure snake oil. Braided things, skin-effect, direction sensitive, oxygen and halogen free bla bla brouhahaa and rolled on the thighs of a virgin during full moon. :? Give me a break will you. Because too few of us will ever hear this, or even waste time in empirical research to debunk or proving all these myths. Changing out your strings to new ones, will bring even better sound to your instrument than ANY cable out there. Go figure.[/quote:28sz17iw] I have the Line6 Relay wireless and I love it. Not to mention the all metal body pack which is nice and solid, but I can actually hear a difference in tone. And on the transmitter there is a knob that you can turn up the "cable length" and it will actually affect the tone and simulate different lengths of cable between your guitar and your board.
9 years ago
·
#24773
0
Votes
Undo
[quote="Tyler":han6bv6i] I have the Line6 Relay wireless and I love it. Not to mention the all metal body pack which is nice and solid, but I can actually hear a difference in tone. And on the transmitter there is a knob that you can turn up the "cable length" and it will actually affect the tone and simulate different lengths of cable between your guitar and your board.[/quote:han6bv6i] Oh, dear. Really, you're puttin us on ... it's a joke right? I would even consider it a joke or put on from Line6's side. They're pulling our leg big time in that case. What's worse, people are swallowing it up. It should be added to the site I linked to above when "10 signs they are selling snake oil.."
9 years ago
·
#24783
0
Votes
Undo
[quote="Mats Eriksson":2jyvl2tb][quote="Tyler":2jyvl2tb] I have the Line6 Relay wireless and I love it. Not to mention the all metal body pack which is nice and solid, but I can actually hear a difference in tone. And on the transmitter there is a knob that you can turn up the "cable length" and it will actually affect the tone and simulate different lengths of cable between your guitar and your board.[/quote:2jyvl2tb] Oh, dear. Really, you're puttin us on ... it's a joke right? I would even consider it a joke or put on from Line6's side. They're pulling our leg big time in that case. What's worse, people are swallowing it up. It should be added to the site I linked to above when "10 signs they are selling snake oil.."[/quote:2jyvl2tb] No it's not a joke, you can read up on it on their website. All it is is a variable resistance rotary switch. You can put it to Zero for no resistance if you so choose. Cables have resistance, all of them, and despite what you may believe, there are some people out there who will do anything to change their tone and make it their unique sound. Its very simple technology, so if you haven't tried it or seen it, don't knock it. And what works for someone might not work for you, that's great! The point of different amps, guitars, pickups, pedals, cables, WIRELESS, cabs, etc etc etc.
9 years ago
·
#24784
0
Votes
Undo
[quote="Tyler":26geexo3]No it's not a joke, you can read up on it on their website. All it is is a variable resistance rotary switch.[/quote:26geexo3] My instructor has said the same thing about the Line6 Relay (where I heard about it in the first place). The switch may not exactly duplicate a 15' cable, but it does a pretty good approximation. Plus you get the flexibility of the wireless. I don't know about you folks, but I feel like a bull in a china shop when I'm playing on stage. I'm always worried I'm going to run into something, or smack my strings on my mic stand creating an ear assaulting cacophony. One less thing to worry about (i.e. the cable)? YES PLEASE! Plus you can walk out into the floor during sound check and actually hear what you and your band sound like. Every single thread I've read on cables always ends the same way -- Massive heated debate. I guess the question goes back to AlbiMax -- Did we help, or hinder? Andrew
9 years ago
·
#24786
0
Votes
Undo
I have a Line6 G30 Relay wireless. While I don't venture far from my stage setup, I like the idea of not being tied down and stepping over my cable(s). I haven't A/B'd it against an actual cable, but it sounds pretty good and works well. I don't use the feature to simulate a cable length.
9 years ago
·
#24825
0
Votes
Undo
[quote:1tfetqrh]Plus you can walk out into the floor during sound check and actually hear what you and your band sound like.[/quote:1tfetqrh] That's why I use a wireless system (a Shure ULXP4) on my main bass (use cables on 2nd or 3rd basses). You would be surprised how different rooms sound, and different spots within the same room. Long-wavelength sounds can often result in hot-spots in one place and dead-spots in other places. Sometimes the sound out front is thin compared to where I stand on stage; other times it is much louder out front. Just because it sounds good on stage doesn't mean it will sound good out front. Yeah, and while I'm out there I can tell the guitarist, with at least some credibility, to turn down his amp. :D However, if I compare the sound quality to my mid-quality cables, I like the cables better.
  • Page :
  • 1
There are no replies made for this post yet.
Be one of the first to reply to this post!